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Day of the Doctor - reviews and opinions - Gay fans of Doctor Who

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Posted

I liked the show, but I have a few issues with Moffat and his ideas. I am never going to accept that John Hurt is "The Doctor". I think he is the Valeyard, or possibly and alternate universe Doctor. Maybe he is like Peter Cushing's role. Cushing was an Earth scientist named "Dr. Who" with granddaughters Susan and Barbara. I believe that if the Doctors changed Gallefrey's fate, then perhaps the (Hurt) Doctor never existed. Why else would we see him start to regenerate, but not into Eccleston? Moffatt took over the story, but as little knowledge of the show's 50 year history. Like many true fans, I believe he is not qualified to tell us how things went. He messed up the Great Intelligence history, helped to alter the Cybermen and Dalek histories. I have seen almost all the available television episodes, read the books to fill those gaps, and even written short stories with better links to past. I think the writers of the show today make up youngsters who do not understand many things of the show pre-1989. Remember when Hartnell's Doctor once said aspirin could kill him? Pat troughton wore a hat for a bit? Pertwee stole a car before he got Bessie and had a tattoo? Tom Baker's Doctor said Madame Notradamus knitted the scarf? The celery would change color if certain toxins were in the air? The 6th Doctor's regeneration was unstable, which was reflwected in his attempt to kill Peri and wear the ugly coat? The 7th Doctor played chess against Fenric throughout many stories adn was thought to be Merlin? The 8th Doctor story made the error calling Doctor half-human? Of course they forgot all this. I say that we, the true fans of Who, speak up and show these "professionals" that we know a bit more about our show then they do.


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Andy_Frankham
Posted

Did you watch the same film as the rest of us? Just before they cut away from Hurt's regeneration you can see Eccleston's features start to form. There really is no question about 'accepting' Hurt as a Doctor - he is, it's not up for debate. McGann regenerated into him in 'Night of the Doctor' and Hurt regenerates into Eccleston in 'Day of the Doctor'. This is the fact of the fiction.

And, although not Moffat's biggest fan, it's patently obvious that he knows the series history and is a 'true' fan. Difference is, he's making a show that will appeal to everyone, not just those fans who constantly moan about every little detail. And as someone who HAS written official Doctor Who merchandise (not to mention a guide book to every Who companion of the last fifty years), I am qualified to say that 'Day of the Doctor' was a successful celebration of the entire series. Countless nods to the past, ALL thirteen incarnations of the Doctor joining forces to save Gallifrey, the return of Tom Baker as a future retired version of the Doctor... It was superb. And adds a more tragic aspect to the series from 2005 onwards. The Doctor lives with survivor's guilt, not knowing that he did, in fact, save Gallifrey... Add so much more pathos to the series.

Seriously, man, watch the show and pay attention.


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Posted

seriously, you want to challenge me to knowledge about Doctor Who? I have written stories, trivia questions, designed art, seen EVERY available to story, read the books to fill in gaps of missing shows, read the stories that followed after the seventh Doctor, after the eighth and into the present Doctor, read "missing episodes" and have kept track of continuity of the villians. Moffathead walks in and decides to "re-invent" the Great Intelligence. That action compares to someone re-telling the Bible stories, only making Jesus wear a mohawk and leather pants. It would be blasphemous. And for him to go up to the blackborad of Doctor Who history and swipe the eraser over huge chunks just so his ideas "work". Sorry, it ain't gonna work. Already, many Whovians have been writing to complain, demanding explanations for his errors in judgement. Who made him the "Who-God"? And FYI, we never actually saw him change. I still say my theory makes more sense. They changed a "fixed point" in Gallefrey's history, so to prevent the entire universe from collapsing into entrophy, the Hurt Doctor was "deleted". And to those that claim Tennant regenerated twice, blame that on Mofatt's rewriting. Remember how Tennant was able to regrow an arm so soon after regenerating? That would never have been accepted in the Classic Who. To explain it in his way (or "Mofatting" it), he passed the energy to that hand. Then later River and Smith Doctor were able to cahnnel there regenerative energies to heal others. That, also would never happen in classic Who.
Anyway, I am not angry at you, and I apologize if it came off that way. But one thing you never want to do with a TRUE Whovian of almost 30 years is tell us we are wrong.


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Andy_Frankham
Posted

Hmmm. Okay. Moffat is producer of Who. Therefore that gives him the right. Despite what fans may think, we don't own the show. And, you assume too much about me with your 'want to challenge me to knowledge about Doctor Who' comment, and those that followed. I have been following the show since I was a kid, which is longer than 30 years ago. I have written a reference book which was published only a few months ago, which covers the entire series and the expanded universe. I assure you, I am well versed in Doctor Who. But I don't claim ownership on it...

And yes, we do see Hurt regenerate into Eccleston. Watch it again and pay attention this time.


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Posted

no problem. We shall just agree to disagree and move on.


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Andy_Frankham
Posted

There's nothing to agree or disagree on. Hurt began regenerating into Eccleston, this is a fact. Not a matter of opinion.


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Posted

I ended this discussion because we both will not admit to errors in judgement (and believe me, if I was wrong, I'd admit it, but that is not happening. END!


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Andy_Frankham
Posted

But it is. At Excel event the guys in charge of special effects were surprised the Hurt/Eccles regeneration was cut back, as it was originally shot with all of Eccles face being seen, but Moffat didn't like the effect so they cut it at the point where you see a bit of Eccles face form.

Do a bit of research next time.


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Posted

For last time, I SAW THE SHOW! I watched it again just a while ago, I even freeze framed at the regeneration. The version I got showed NOTHING of Eccleson's features. Hurt and the REAL Doctors changed a fixed point in history. I think HUrt was formed not long after McGann left Earth. Possibly immediately afterwards he changed into Hurt. And if we were to go by the rules set by the Eccleston into Tennant moment (and by Romana in Destiny of the Daleks), perhaps he "tweeked" it. Maybe due to the traumatic situations that caused McCoy/McGann regeneration, he was not quite stable. And remember immediately after he got back in TARDIS, he was tortured and traumatized by the Master. Which by the way, the 1996 story had many flaws as well. Why was the Master on trial in front of Daleks? Daleks would just EX-TERM-IN-ATE him on site. So maybe the McGann story was outside the realm of the Whoniverse. Perhaps The real regeneration was McCoy into Hurt? Once again, I, a true fan follower of the Doctor (Theta Sigma) have shown more logical theories than the Mofatthead.
------------------------------------------END DISCUSSION---------------------------------------


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Andy_Frankham
Posted

What nonsense. Night of the Doctor clearly shows an 8th Doctor a long time after he left Earth in the TVM, especially considering he name checks his companions from his Big Finish audio series. And he regenerated into Hurt on screen during the Time War. All established in canon in Night of the Doctor. Believe what you will, the fact remains the fact. Hurt regenerates in Eccleston at the end of Day of the Doctor, a fact proven by the formation of Eccleston's face and the production crew revealing that the original shot was longer but didn't look as effective.

Don't peddle your theories as fact, especially when they flatly contradict what has been established on screen. Just because you don't like what's being done. Kind of too bad. Moffat is producer. He sets the rules. If you don't like what he's doing, don't watch the series any more.

Just wow, really.


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Posted

really? your "logic" is "we see McGann..."? We see stock footage. We also saw hartnell, Troughton and Pertwee. Just another flaw. Hurt basically was the "un-Doctor" who "un-regenerated" to fix the time stream. Tennant did say the time lines were in flux, and Hurt would not remember the events. Hurt is like a scribble on the black board. It was put there without thought, and easily removed with a swipe of the eraser. Another error, that board with pics of all the companions. How would UNIT have a pic of Sara Kingdom and Katarina? Yes, they were both there, but neither ever appeared on Earth in front of Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart (partly because Bret Vyon was involved). Katarina was only with Doctor a very short time and was never on Earth during UNIT age. Sara Kingdom never worked with UNIT. The 1st Doctor never met up with UNIT (until the Three Doctors show) Again, I have to stress I have attempted closing this discussion, but some do not get the hint...
__________________END DISCUSSSION_____________________________
GET IT? OVER! FINISHED! FINITO! FINALE! END! STOP! CEASE! WHOA! SHADDUP! lol


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Posted

My very last comment about this to certain people is this: then how do you explain The Watcher (Logopolis) and the Valeyard? Nyssa's quote "He was the Doctor all the time..." The Master during the trial, "he (Valeyard) is an amalgamation of your dark side, somewhere between your 12th and final regeneration..." Game Set Match to me.


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Phil_Lex_Archer
Posted

well this was a heated but interesting discussion and to remark that Hurt is/was an unrelated regeneration that does not exist with the Doctor's regen cycle rather messes up the Matt smith is the last regeneration of the Doctor, nbr 13 as we are soon to discover.


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Posted

I read that the DVD release of this show is scheduled to be next Tuesday (December 10, 2013) I will definitely grab one. Hope it has decent extras!


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Phil_Lex_Archer
Posted

The release is already here in England, extras comprise of all the Minisode's, Night of The Doctor, and The Last Day. A short making of DOTD - Behind The Lens, and two promo trailers.


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Posted

Sounds cool. I definitely wanna see all those extras. Do they still have those PROMS concerts? I would love to see another one


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Phil_Lex_Archer
Posted

The Most recent PROMS concert aired earlier in the year, whether it will be avaialble on a further DVD release is still yet to be confirmed.


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Posted

cool. I enjoy those concerts. Wish I could go to one live. I just fear that when Capaldi takes over, we lose the "fun" Doctors and get an old fogey!


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Phil_Lex_Archer
Posted

So try to remember DOCTOR WHO at its height of fame and success, was led by 'old fogey' front men and still retained its fun in many various episodes of
yesteryear.. What Capaldi will refresh is a more interesting turn of character, instead of the bumkum that we have had in the last few years. The Doctor now needs to be more a force to be reckoned with rather than a wish washy woe is me persona.


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Posted

Just bought the DVD of the show. It includes Night of the Doctor short and "Last Day", a short film from the eyes of a Time Lord on Arcadia right before the Dalek attack.


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