Jump to content
gstanescu84

The Church - Gay Guys! <3

Recommended Posts

gstanescu84
Posted

A Penny for your thoughts on this discussion. Pls keep it clean(no sexual or hate intended or most important offence to any religion). I was debating or talking to my Aunty who is a Sister(Nun) a member of a Religious Order today. I must say the things I learned of the Roman Catholic Church, caught me quite surprised. It would appear Marriage of Priests did exist over 900 yrs ago. The fat cats isntaed banned over(get this!!!!) Land which in turn money. Now isnt dat a load of bollony???. 2ndly When we are in Church and there is a Church collection, we are actually paying the priests. It was my understanding that they are paid by the Church themselves NOT us. So let me ask you all - What is ur opinion on this topic, and secondly imagine paying people to hate Homosexuality, Gay Marriage etc., etc., Down right outrageous. I asked my Aunty a very simple Question and I quote: "Who pays for the Pope's beautiful robe(i'm sure you know what am talking about)" I acted like my own TV Anchor. She kept going round about way. Eventually she gave in, and answered the question.


Tiggerdean
Posted

I'm an atheist and think that the current situation with the pope stepping down helps the argument that religion, although helpful to some, is perhaps a psychological disorder.


Posted

Well, The church recieves all of the money it gets from the parishioners. So the short answer is that yes, the tithes and offerings recieved by the church pay the minister. There are a few more steps in the process, but essentially that is the size of it. I wasn't raised Catholic, I was raised in another religion. As far as priests getting married, any religion has to brin in new members, and there are two ways to bring in new members. You either have to convert them, or birth them. A lot of times, birthing them is easier than converting them. I can see where if you are needing new members in large numbers, allowing priests to marry and procreate is a way to build memberships quickly. I wonder if we won't be seeing the church reverse itself on the issue of priests getting married again in the future.


Dave_Mack
Posted

I can certainly provide information here as a lifelong catholic. What is put into the collection at Mass is usually for the parish itself. This pays the bills including the Priests salary. They have 2nd collections for outside or special items such as the Pope, Missions etc. One that was used for a parish was for "Freddy the Furnace". It was an old heating system that had to be replaced and they asked the parishioneers to help. Not only did they get enuf $$ to replace it there was a member of the congregation who owned or worked for an oil burner company and they donated their labor to replace it and got the replacement burner/furnace wholesale,

Now on the celebacy topic it was instituted in about the 11th century. It had nothing to do with holiness. Priests wives and family were inheriting property and the Church wanted the property so the easiest way to pull this off was to ban priests from marriage. Get this... They were ordered to abandon their families and renounce the property or have it donated to the church and the family thrown into the street (real Christan Charity). Through the years as priests passed away new ones were required be celebate as a prerequisate to being ordained. Remember that Popes had families until the decree. Long after the decree popes fathered children through women to whom they were not married. They then named their offspring to clerical states even tho they had no training.

So while we see all the bad that happenned while Benedict has been in office remember that he personally as far as we know never fathered a child nor molested any children. This is not to defend him, I can't tell you how glad I am he is done! He has done a lot of harm to the church. I pray we get a more centrist pope who has the guts to do what's needed. We need to abolish the requirement of celebacy, invite back those priests who left only because they were forced to choose between the church or a woman they loved, invite those permanent deacons who were denied Priesthood simply because they were married, and lastly we MUST start ordaining women. Lets face it,.... physically the only difference netween men and women is sex organs. The excuse that Jesus didn't have women apostles is NOT a valid reason. At that time in history women were 3rd class citizens!

Hope I have helped in this discussion. Feel free to post questions. No I am not and never was a priest. I just know the facts and have read up on all this..

Dave


sumyngcum
Posted

y else do u think they walk around with those robes......so u cant c the boner underneath....around those alter boys...!!!!


gstanescu84
Posted

Well well, my god, I read your piece(Dave M) with great interest. Thank you very much sharing.

As regards Priests marrying, I fully support them. NO man is an island. Women Ordination a must. The Church is so backwards.

At the end of the day "The follower" are actually paying the Church for all the backwardness. That is my view. My aunty was very defenseless when I brought up this very topic where the followers/congregation are paying for all this hatred. I read with great sadness Dave the priests had to give up their familys and loved one. How da hell could the Church be so cold to even make such an Ultimatum.


Dave_Mack
Posted

Georgian what i think you may not know is when a man is orfained he takes a vow of obedience to his bishop and the bishops successors. What ever he is told to do he is obliged to do, History has painted a very dim biew on many things the catholic church ahs done thru the centuries... like the crusades.... burning people at the stake.... allegations of herasey... etc. If they tried that in this day and age the clergy WOULD be jailed! Civil law won't allow things of the past any more. Remember that priests were untouchable in legal circles until the scandal hit. It was unheard of to jail a priest. Now we not only know it happens but the media reports it. No longer do they get a free pass.

Now as for the church being so cold remember they are like a monarchy. They don't care about eh individual... they care about the institution. Hence the coverup of crimes by these priests. In defense I do want to say that it is by comparrison a small minority who have molested kids/teens. Most are fine upstanding men who do a very difficult job under trying circumstances made so by the few bad apples.


David_Cloud
Posted

I really appreciate what you have said Dave. A very sound and balanced explanation. I am sure the majority of parish priests really try to do good within their communities. However, I do get upset, well annoyed actually, when I see all those fat cardinals swarming round the Pope. In my mind that is the rotten pinnacle of the institution and those cardinals and Vatican courtiers are a bit like the fat bankers who try to perpetuate the pinnacle of the financial world because it gives them a more comfortable lifestyle than they deserve and their egos lead them to think they are above the law. Regrettably the Church (of most denominations) exhibits so many of the weaknesses of Man and often diverts us from focussing on God.


Dave_Mack
Posted

How true. Remember a fish smells from the head down. On a stictly personal feeling I am thrilled that Benedict/Ratzinger is abdicating. I know who I want to see replace him and have made a prediction but I will wait until the conclave to see if I am right. What the next pope should do is a top to bottom house cleaning. He should solict input from local diocese as to whether their current Bishop or Cardinal is, in the opinion of the faithfull, doing a good job. It is because these bishops/cardinals feel they are above everyone else that they can get away with things. If the members of the local diocese could directly tell Rome about things they KNOW are not being done correctly that would give the Vatican a reason to make changes. Consider cardinal Law. Had the Vatican been told of what was happenning in detail here in Boston for so many years they could have removed Law and fixed things much faster. Yet they simply believe whatever the local Bishop or Cardinal says gospel.

Trust me if the right man is elected there will be massive changes. If however the wrong man is elected it will be more of the same old same old and the good-old-boy network will continue.

The catholic church as an institution is on the ropes. I am not speaking of Faith. I am speaking of the institution. I and many others I know will NOT give any money to the church except for the local parish collection. No money to the missions, the cardinals appeals, the Vatican...nothing. I have seen the church take that money and use it for anti gay, anti womens rights and other causes I do not support. I had ceased giving to the retired priests collection until I was assured by the pastor (whom I trust implicitly) that every red cent went to that cause and nothing else. I have no problem supporting those elderly priests who did a great job of service for many years. I just needed to make sure the money went to nothing else

Tomorrow at 2pm (EST) Ratzinger/Benedict steps down. I can't express my sheer delight and joy. At least the prayers I and many have prayed for his removal/death/abdication have come true.


David_Cloud
Posted

Dave, I'm not Roman Catholic but sort of Church of England - or I would be if they reformed their attitude as well. But I will light a candle of hope in my heart with you at 2pm tomorrow EST and let's pray for a better world and churches that are more about God and less about Man. I've been moved by what you've written Dave. x


gstanescu84
Posted

Aww bless you guys. Especially David C. Much appreciated. Like Priests in UK can marry etc., known as Vicors and in the USA Pastors depending on the state your situated in.



×